Holly 0:00

So the weight of it for me was really that all of his money was going to my past mistake you could say. So that hit me hard that my husband was working so hard to pay off my past.

Unknown Speaker 0:17

You're listening to the winning to wealth Podcast, where you'll hear real stories from real people who are on the path to building real wealth. These stories will show you how to earn more money and pay off debt, start investing, and make better money choices so you can build wealth for your future. Now, here's your host, Michael Lacy,

Michael Lacy 0:39

what's up? What's up? What's up teammates. Welcome to Episode 30 of the winning to wealth podcast. And this week, we're sharing a super interesting debt free story. In this story, we're going to talk a little about how you can still enjoy your life while you're paying off debt. And so sharing with us today is a super cool friend that I met on Instagram, Holly. At one point, Holly realized that she and her husband were hundred and $35,000 in debt. So we're going to hear how they started to work together, how they paid all that debt off. And then Holly is going to share the plans they have for building wealth going forward. Now if you want the Show Notes for this episode, head over to winning to wealth comm slash Episode 30. Also, if this is your first time here with us and you're looking to get started on your own wealth building journey, I created the winning to wealth playbook just for you. This book is absolutely free. And really, my whole goal with it is to give you some clear, easy to follow steps that you can take to start making winning money decisions today. Again, it's totally free and you can get your copy at winning to wealth.com slash playbook that is winning to wealth. dot com slash playbook. All right, so let's jump right into this episode with Holly about her debt free journey.

Alright, so first things first, Holly, welcome to the show. I'm excited to learn a little more about your story because from what I do know, it's one that can really have a positive impact on other people who are trying to work themselves out of debt as well. So, thank you so much for being here and agreeing to come on and just share more about your journey. But the first thing I want to know is how exactly did you and your husband find yourselves $135,000 in debt in the first place?

Holly 2:41

It's a lot. It's definitely a lot. The biggest majority of it is my student loans. I so I graduated college in 2007. And I graduated with $113,000 worth of student loan debt. This was my undergrad too. This was only an undergrad. I put everything Single expense on student loans, my tuition, my housing, my spending money. And then the balance of that was split between credit cards that I had, and then also a short term car finance. So when I think of student loans and our I'm sorry, when I think of my debt, I kind of really think of my student loans just because that was the bulk and just because that's what my debt free journey was really focused on.

Michael Lacy 3:26

Right. And so I mean, let's go into that. So when did it hit you that you had so much debt? And how did it feel in that moment?

Holly 3:33

I actually kind of had two moments. I would say the first moment was back in my kitchen of my apartment and Washington Heights. When I opened that student loan bill for the first time and I saw I owed over $1,000 a month in student loans. And I was living in New York City making $10 an hour as an intern with no guaranteed pay. I packed all my bags moved to New York with the hopes of not coming back, no job potential. So that's when it first hit me. But the crazy thing is it wasn't the six figures worth of debt that hit me. It was the monthly payment that hit me. And it's so interesting. I feel like that really speaks volumes about the mindset shift that has happened over the years. Because before I used to be so concerned about what's this going to cost monthly, and now I look at the big picture. So fast forward to 2016. And that's when the weight of $135,000 really hit me like a truck. That's when I was realizing that, wow, this is really hindering mine and my husband's future. And you know, there's guilt with that because it's I brought this debt into our marriage. My husband had a few student loans he paid them off early. I'm the one that entered this marriage with this six figures with a debt. Granted, we were always variable open about it. And pretty much since the beginning of our relationship, we did talk about money. So it wasn't a huge secret, but it was still there. So the weight of it for me was really that all of his money was going to my past mistake, you could say. So that hit me hard that my husband was working so hard to pay off my past. You know what I mean? And yeah,

Michael Lacy 5:24

well, let me so let me ask, I mean, how do you deal with that? Right? Because that's, that's really heavy. And, you know, I'm sure that there's somebody out there that's in a similar situation. So, you know, what are some things that helps you kind of move past that feeling of, you know, the shame or the weight of all of that? Sure.

Holly 5:42

Well, I have to say, I'm extremely lucky and my husband has always been crazy supportive and understanding. And he has never once made me feel like I did something wrong or he never was like, I'm the one making the money. I'm paying off your debts, like any guilt I felt was for me. So I was very lucky in that case, but I'd say in 2016, once this journey really got underway, it was kind of realizing there's a problem. I can't change the past, all I can do is change the future. And that's kind of the mindset change that had to happen. And I just had to focus on Okay, what's the game plan going forward? We can say whatever we're going to say about the past, but we need a game plan now and let's move with that game plan.

Michael Lacy 6:32

So okay, so then you you kind of have this awakening, you set up a game plan, right. And so was your husband initially on board? Or what were some of those initial conversations like

Holly 6:45

a resounding yes. He was on board way before I was on board. He actually pretty much since we went met, wanted to pay extra on my student loans, and I wasn't for it, I just I didn't see the point it was kind of I had accepted long before meeting him that this is just what it is. I have at the time after refinancing, I have a 500 a month student loan payment that I'm going to have until I'm 53. And that's what it is under story period. And it's not going to didn't bother me. It's just that yeah, it was just an acceptance. It's just like, you know, I'm always gonna have rent or I'm always gonna have a car payment, you know, those sort of things like that. I just accepted it as fast. And so when I came to him, after binge listening to Dave Ramsey for just hours and hours a day, and like, you know, I think we should pay off debt early. I mean, you can imagine he's like, are you kidding me like this for years? What's wrong with you? I've literally been saying this for years. So he was actually very onboard, but it was at that moment going forward. For anyone familiar Dave Ramsey, gizelle, intense blah, blah, blah. It was for my husband and I, okay, what what is the gameplan? How, how intense do we want to go? How fast do we want to do this? And really, those are the kind of things that differ. But he was totally on board way before I was and it was just kind of like a roll. I told you. So when I finally had to hear it from someone else, that not only was this possible for me, but that it would have so much greater of an impact than I ever realized.

Michael Lacy 8:37

So let's go back a step. I mean, so because you mentioned that you had been listening to the Dave Ramsey podcast, your husband had kind of been in your ear. And you you have this awakening, right? Yes. What was it that made you realize that something needed to change about the way that you were doing things?

Holly 8:55

So back in 2016, I had been working full time I'm at a corporate job and I had been there for nine years. And my brought my boss brought me in one day and basically was telling me my department was going to have a huge change. And my job as I knew it was basically going to be over. And I could stay on board doing a job that basically I hated or possibly go to different departments that I might like more, or, you know, basically, I would leave. And there was kind of two things happening at that point, one for the past, like two years, the job I loved so much that I love the people. I just loved everything about it. It wasn't really there anymore. And it did change and I was losing my momentum and my motivation day by day. And I had just been there long enough, but I probably would have stayed had it not been for my husband and I had a side business at the time and the side business was really taking off. It was taking over like our entire personal life. And we're like, maybe we should try to do this full time. So my husband and I had those conversations about, could we make this work. And at that point, we decided, Okay, I'm going to leave my job, we're gonna, you know, this is a sign from above that this is happening. And we're going to take this side business on full time. And by the way, this all happened the same week that we were set to close on our first condo together, and our first home. So luckily, very lucky, we were conservative with our home buying, but our payment was going to be a much bigger chunk of our expenses than we expected. So anyway, so basically, if we were going to do this, if I was going to leave the corporate world to take on our side business full time and basically take no pay, we had to run the numbers, and we had to get on a zero based budget to see if this was actually going to work. And at that point, we realized that we can do this it's going to work. And then it was actually the debt free journey that was a result of this like really realizing how much this debt was holding us back to that if we were going to open this business that's already taking a financial risk, we need as little or as few financial risks in our lives as possible. So having the debt was a financial risk, that's a payment we have to worry about every single month. And also, you know, binge listening to Dave Ramsey all the time made me want to get rid of that debt super fast. So it's really funny that the debt free part of our journey was a side result of this business. The business actually closed this past November. And it's funny, I'll always be forever grateful for it, because it led me on this debt free journey, like forever grateful. And it led me to get rid of my debt and get my finances in order.

Michael Lacy 11:41

Let's talk about some of those initial steps that you guys had to take. I've heard you say zero base budget. What were some of the other things that you had to do in order to get yourself financially organized so that you could tackle this debt in such a short amount of time?

Holly 11:55

Sure. Well, I think honestly, a zero based budget It is and I'll just kind of briefly go over it really quickly. If anyone's not familiar with it. Basically a zero based budget means every dollar coming in from your income is going to be assigned to an expense in your life. Whether it's a fixed expense, a variable expense, debt savings, whatever it is, every dollar gets a name. And then once everything coming in is assigned to something you're left with zero, so zero based budget, but the Zero Based budget is what to me kind of what I owe all of my debt paying off to it was really part of that zero based budget. We had to, we had to tone down our lifestyle. At the time we were living in New York City. And in New York City. It is very common for people to eat out lunch every single day to eat out dinner every single day. I know countless people who do not keep food in their homes because you buy it every day. You know, I went shopping all the time and I'm not even talking about shopping and expensive places. I'd be at doing shopping sprees at h&m or forever 21 or you know, traveling and you know, my husband and I were never like, really frivolous. But you know, these shopping sprees, I use that term loosely at these very inexpensive places, you know that heads up. And so it was really just all about paring down our lifestyle, particularly with like the grocery budget, the eating out budget, the travel budget, and also sadly, what killed me the most is I had to bring down my gifting budget because I was the type of person I knew when I first lived in New York City. I was sending money to ASPCA and then I don't have money to eat myself, to give it all to them. And so, and I would maxed out my credit cards to buy people Christmas presents. And so it was really just, you know, a mindset change. They're like, when I gift I'm like, Okay, this is what I can actually afford. We still gave the entire time but I had to bring down my budgets for all that considerably for you know, my family or donations, whatever it was,

Michael Lacy 13:59

so Something very interesting that you mentioned there was the food cost and foods. Yes, yeah. And so can you share just some of the things you had to do in order to get the food spending under control?

Holly 14:11

Yes, absolutely. Food is, to me one of the biggest expenditures in a budget, but also one of the easiest things to bring down. Maybe not easy in practice, I should say. But one of the things that can save you the most money in your budget and food happens to be the number one way we save literally hundreds per month in money. So it was kind of a twofer. One is for we brought down our restaurants spending considerably. So again, in New York City, people are buying lunch and dinner on the regular. And so for us, we were packing lunches every single day. And you know, we weren't perfect. I'd have some of those lazy days or weeks in all honesty, but we were Always trying to pack lunches and then we are trying to eat the majority of our dinners at home. And also in New York City in the tri state area. We have seamless grub hub if people are familiar with it, where you can get basically anything delivered at any time. And so we love that and we use it all the time. So for us, it was really about bringing that budget down by hundreds, hundreds of dollars a month. So that was one kind of easy way to do it. And also being careful or being more conscious, where we spend our money like, Are we going to happy hours are we going to more inexpensive places, maybe not ordering as much alcohol when we go out like I'm not going to get rid of my alcohol because I'm going out I want a glass of wine, maybe not have five glasses of wine. And then the other part of it I would definitely say was huge is bringing down our grocery budget. And this is something that I saw the national averages once and it was I have them right in front of me, but it shot I remember it's shocking me how much people spend on groceries a month. And I see it all the time people over buy but bringing down groceries has been a huge help. And there's a few ways that I did this one is meal planning. I think the first step absolutely to meal prepping is meal planning. And when you meal plan, what you do is you shop your fridge, pantry and freezer first, and you eat up what you have. And that sounds like such a simple concept. But how many of us see a recipe on Pinterest and then go and buy all the ingredients for it so we can make it and then we have like 80% of the ingredients leftover if you need a tablespoon of this and you know a cup of this. And so planning your meals around what you have then planning meals around what's on sale at the grocery store being flexible with that, and then also couponing I did coupon pretty heavily for a while I honestly don't coupon as much anymore because usually if buying something, it's off brand or it's fresh produce. So unless I'm using my ibotta app, there's not really a lot of coupons for the things I buy. But and then the last step to that is meal prepping. And this is huge. I tend to meal prep, either every Sunday or Monday. And what I'll do is anything that needs to be made in advance like lunches, takeaway lunches, or dinners that need to be made in advance, I make these on the weekend. That way you take away all these entation to buy your lunch out or to get takeout on a weekday because you don't have enough time. I mean, how many of us have done this? So many times just like oh, you know, I'm tired or I don't have enough time. So we'll just go through the drive thru and when you meal prep, you take that out of the equation.

Michael Lacy 17:50

I mean, I know for us a lot of the times when you know we're going out to dinner or we're going to happy hours or you know, we're doing things like that that are outings when it comes to Food. We're doing those things with family and friends like, yeah, we have our date nights and things like that. But a lot of the times were with family and we were friends, we're celebrating something. And so that just kind of naturally leads to my next question, which is kind of how did your family and friends react to you guys being on this journey and making such a drastic lifestyle changes?

Holly 18:19

Well, I don't think we necessarily shared it with our family, but it wasn't necessarily a secret. I will say that I think once we went from two incomes to one, I think a lot of people understood that okay, well, clearly, we don't have as much money, as much disposable money to throw around. But I think some people consider this cheap because my husband and I were always the first to maybe roll our eyes or say something about the restaurant choice or how much the meals are or you know how much this gift is or how much you This is gonna cost like, my husband and I were never like really shy about like, this isn't in our budget. And I think we used to keep it mainly to that, like, this isn't in our budget not Hey, we're on a debt free journey, everyone, we got to pay off my student loans. It was more just like, this isn't working for us right now. But I will say there are certain events that we kind of knew. Were out of our control. Like, my husband has a very large Italian family here in Jersey, they're all pretty local. And so we're outnumbered greatly. And so there were certain events that we know Okay, well, this is going to be where we're going for dinner. We can't change that we don't really have a say. So instead of making a stink about it, and you know, just complaining about something we can't really change. For us. What worked is mainly just like, knowing Okay, we should kind of keep this money aside for that dinner knowing we're going to spend more than we would have if we went out or by ourselves or if we chose the restaurant, we kind of keep it consciously in our budget.

Michael Lacy 20:05

Now, you know, I like that because, you know, personal finance is personal. Yeah. And so we have to do things that work for us to have to do things that work for our household, our lifestyle, our marriages, our families, all those sorts of things. And so I love the fact that you said, we didn't just eliminate one thing, we just pare down some things. And we use that to catapult us because there are so many different ways that you can attack your debt. And so I'm so glad to hear somebody say that. So let me ask this question. I mean, were there any Did you guys face any difficult challenges while you were paying off debt? And if so, kind of how did you overcome those?

Holly 20:43

I don't think there was anything honestly huge that we overcame, like there's no one particular thing that's sticking out. The only thing I'll say is that at different points throughout the journey and blame it on me being a woman with a prerogative to change my mind 1000 times a day. Day, I think at different points, we had differing opinions on how we should pay it off, or how fast or where the money should come from or comfort levels with how much we have an emergency fund or do we want to take this money from here and put it to debt? I think that was probably the ongoing challenge that we have throughout the process.

Michael Lacy 21:24

So how do you I mean, as a couple because it's not just you on the journey, how do you as a couple sit down and decide what to do when you're having those, you know, those discussions about the little nuances with how much we're going to put you know, here and are we going to do snowball avalanche, you know, all those things. So how do you do that when you're part of a team and not just as a single person?

Holly 21:45

For us, I guess the biggest thing for me was showing my husband's and numbers because I so kind of working from home, you could say or being the home economist, I was the one really looking at the numbers on a day to day basis. He wasn't, we'd have mainly a monthly checkup. But he wasn't the one always looking at the numbers. I was in charge of them. So in my head, I'm like, Okay, well, I know where we are. And I know where we could be. And I know how fast we could do it. But he wasn't seeing that. So for me, it was really about showing him the facts. That's what worked for us. And I know everyone's going to be different. But I think the biggest thing is you have to be opening to listen, you can't just speak to speak, you have to also or you can't just have a conversation to speak, you have to have a conversation to also listen and really digest what the other person is saying. And again, like you said, personal personal finance is personal. So I realize everyone's going to be a little bit different, but what works for us and what works I guess you could say my husband getting on board with what I think is really just showing him the numbers. He's a numbers person and he wants to know Okay, well where's this going to be? Take us, you know, this month this year, five years from now.

Michael Lacy 23:04

Okay, so then let's let's fast forward to that very last moment. I mean, that moment where you guys hit Submit on that last payment. So walk me through kind of the build up for them and what was that day? Like? What was that moment like and all those sorts of emotions and things that you guys were dealing with on that day.

Holly 23:24

It's kind of funny because we had, like a month long build up to that. It was, I think, the beginning of December when I was kind of looking at all of our numbers. And I'm just like, Okay, well, I think we can do this. I'm like, Okay, if we drain like every single cent we have, and be very, very careful. We could do this technically, by the end of the year, we could start 20 the new decade off debt free. And it was kind of an awkward time because my husband's like my husband's payroll is about to change and checks. We're going to start hitting at different times, and then You know, we want to make sure they actually came through when they were supposed to. So my husband being the more safe person that he is conservative. He's like, no, this isn't happening. So it was January 5, that we actually did it. And I think it was a Monday, it was a random weekday, and I'm just like, okay, so when are you okay with us, you know, just just setting in this last payment, like, the thing is, I knew we had it, but it was going to bring us very far down in our emergency fund, which has always made my husband very uncomfortable. And again, it was at that point showing him the numbers that Okay, we're going to be okay, if we do this, that he was like, okay, you know, go ahead and submit. And so he wasn't quite as excited as I was because I'm the one that's lived with these for so long. But when I hit that Submit button, submit button, I was I was so excited. I was grinning ear to ear I just like I was so happy and I was kind of surprised how happy I was. And then emotional about it. But then the second I like said it out loud, I hit submit. I said it out loud to my husband and I said, I'm debt free. Oh my gosh, you start crying again. I'm like, we're debt free. There's no more student loans. It was like the past 13 years were flashing before me it was just like, I could see that very moment standing in my kitchen in Washington Heights, opening up that letter finding out how much I'm gonna owe. And I thought about, you know, all the different emotions that went with it. I was just, you know, so confused. I was angry, I was sad. I was defeated. And then, you know, the acceptance. And then I thought back you know, in more recent years where I do like these, what if budgets and you know, maybe I'll have this paid off before I'm 45 or you know, all these What if different scenarios. And then it was like, I can't believe we did this. Like, I can't believe we did it in this fashion. And it was just like I was a ball of emotions. I just like kept crying about it. And it was unbelievable and really kind of indescribable. I'm like, it's my turn. If you know listening to Dave Ramsey so much every single hour you hear a debt free scream. And I always thought even when in my debt free journey, I always thought that was gonna be so far off for me like that was gonna still be 10 years from now if I'm really intense, and the fact that we did it so quickly. I just I couldn't believe it. I really I couldn't believe it was my turn to do my debt free scream it was it was incredible. And then I spent the next several days after people congratulating me just like crying with every single nice thing that people like every single Congrats, I just like, couldn't stop crying. It's very emotional. It's it's, you know, it's such a mental feat to say It's such a mental feat to pay off all this debt and to really be that dedicated to something.

Michael Lacy 27:08

I know a name that you've mentioned a couple times on this episode of Ramsey Were there any other voices or books or podcasts or anything like that, that maybe you guys were listening to that helped you along the journey?

Holly 27:22

I would say he was the only podcast I was listening to. And I did read his total money makeover which discusses in length his seven baby steps I after that, I love Love, love Chris Hogan. I think he's wonderful. So I love I loved listening to him speak on the Dave Ramsey show. And I've also read a couple of his books, not necessarily about becoming debt free, but just about more retirement and long term thinking. So he's been a huge inspiration and then the past I think almost year I created a separate Instagram account, specifically within The debt free community, and that, through that Instagram account, I have gotten so much motivation. I mean, it's funny, like, my husband would kind of make fun of me a little bit, because he's just like, it almost made me compete. But I don't mean that in like, I want to when I guess it really just inspired me to be like, I want to pay off debt so fast, like I want to get it done. And it just like, so many like accounts just really inspired me to get this done. And I'm like, okay, they can do it. I can do it. Like they're doing the same thing. We got this. So I feel like finding a tribe on Instagram was also really, really huge. For me. That was really, I feel like that kind of took my motivation to the next level.

Michael Lacy 28:46

Right, right. And so now that you guys have become debt free, because like you said, I mean, this is a huge mental feat, right? This Yeah, a lot of dedication. A lot of lifestyle changes a lot of sacrifices. So Where are you going to put that focus now that you've accomplished that goal? Like what's next for you guys?

Holly 29:05

So next is a single family home, we are saving at all for a downpayment. So it's funny, everyone's like, what are you gonna do? Are you gonna go out and celebrate? And like, years ago when we first started thinking about this, and when we really first started the journey, I was like, we're going to the Dominican Republic, the second we become debt free and now we're like, Okay, well, we did it. That's done. The thing is, we need to save her downpayment. So we're being insanely practical. Even my husband he got you know, a bonus very recently from work and he, you know, in my eyes, he's paid all this money towards debt, and he's wanted virtual reality for just such a long time. I'm like, go get a VR, pull the trigger, go do it. Like, we can afford it. It's okay, you you deserve this. Like, I don't like using the words you deserve it. I think that gets people in trouble, but I'm just like, go do it. And he's like, I can't I just The couple hundred dollars when we need to buy a house. So that's our focus. It's also building up our emergency fund to give us like a full six months and then kind of at the same time saving for our house, get that dream single family home. And it's funny, it almost feels like more of a more of a challenge than paying off all our debt because now I'm so eager for it. And I want to do it, you know, relatively quickly. So that's what's next for us.

Michael Lacy 30:31

Gotcha. And so, I mean, looking into the future, have you guys thought about some of the ways that you plan to build wealth for yourself going forward?

Holly 30:40

Oh, yes, I am all about the wealth building for the future. You can ask like, my husband and I like say all the time. I'm like, I want to be able to retire at 60 and I'm not saying I want to retire at 60. But I want the financial means if you know I want to Or if God forbid, something happens, or if I can't find a job, I want the means to retire when I'm 60, which is not that far off. And so what we've done so far is we actually doubled my husband's 401k contributions. So right now the only thing we have his his current 401k contributions, and then I also from my previous job, have a 401k that's growing. And then next step would be opening Roth IRAs. And then once we get the house, it's going to be about investing, bringing that investment, you know, like Dave Ramsey suggests up to around a 15% Mark, kind of, you know, we'll crunch the numbers and see what's going to get us to that retirement lifestyle we want but right now 401 K's soon to open Roth, IRAs and then to start investing outside of those.

Michael Lacy 31:57

Gotcha. So hey, I want to To say, thank you so much for agreeing to come on the show. I've had a fantastic time with you. And you shared a lot of good and practical tips. So I want to give you this opportunity to share with the listeners out there where they can find you if they want to follow along as you go into this next phase of your journey.

Holly 32:17

Sure. Well, thank you so much for having me on. I feel so honored. I mean, who would have thunk it, I'm just like a girl just doing my thing and someone wants me to talk about it. That's crazy to me. But if you want to hear more about my journey, I share it on Instagram. And my account name is from possibility to actuality. And there I share on the daily on my feed and in my stories all about the little things I do day to day that make the biggest difference in your budget and your debt free journey. And then also I recently started a YouTube channel I'm very excited about and still learning about and it's also called from possibility to actuality and I'll be sharing in more depth on that channel about my debt free journey, how I got there and what's next.

Michael Lacy 33:05

Awesome well Holly I'll be sure to link to your Instagram and your YouTube channel in the show notes which you teammates can find that winning to wealth comm slash Episode 30 Go check Holly out on both of those places. She's super awesome a great inspiration to those of you who are in the thick of your own debt free journey. Again, you can find the show notes at winning to wealth comm slash Episode 30. Now the winner of the week from this episode is to always give yourself options. See at the beginning of this journey, Holly's job changed and she didn't like it one bit. And so instead of just suffering through something that wasn't fulfilling for the next 40 years, Holly changed the situation. She realized and took advantage of the opportunity and the option to quit her job and focused on the side business and that is what sparked the debt free journey. Now maybe your option is an aside, baby But you know what your option can be money in the bank. See, having enough money saved and invested can make you feel comfortable and confident enough to walk away from an unfulfilling job to pursue an opportunity that is actually fulfilling, even when you won't make as much money from that new opportunity. But see, here's the thing, Holly didn't even realize she had options until she sat down and created a spending plan. So if you haven't yet, now's a great time to create your own monthly spending plan so that you can start giving yourself more options to take better control over your life. Now, I want to hear from you what was your big win? What was your takeaway from this episode, head over to my private Facebook group and let me know you can find the link in the episode description or by heading over to winning to wealth comm slash teammates. Either way, I'd love to hear what you got from this episode. But that's all the time I have this week. So until we talk Knock again keep racking up those wins one at a time. We'll talk soon.

Unknown Speaker 35:06

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